Job offers on 43oh

[Rickta59 589]

I doubt you are going to be swamped by job postings.  If I wanted to get something done by someone on here, I'd probably private message. I'd be looking at someone who already did similar work and posted about it. Opening your post to a bunch of hobbyists isn't going to get the results you want nor is it a smart thing to broadcast your product plans.

[zeke 693]

I see that some users have icons underneath their avatars. How do I earn one for myself? Surely, by now, I have done something to merit one 

 

 

As a distinguishing feature, could we use the icon system to tell solicitors that we are not just a hobbyist but we are available for hire too?

 

@@bluehash, would it be possible to buy a "Contractor" icon from you and have it added to my avatar?

[Rei Vilo 695]

Now, I understand better the need for job offers. If adding such a section can generate a revenue stream for the 43oh and sisters websites, why not? 

 

I see another benefit: gaining visibility and recognition. The LaunchPads are great tools for rapid prototyping and not just blinking a LED, and hobbyists may gain recognition for their development.

 

Contrary to other forums dedicated to hobbyists' platforms

[igor 163]

Thanks to everyone for your inputs. By job offers, I meant tiny projects.. not search for employees. 

 

Please continue this discussion. Just some points:

 

2. There was the idea that  a developer would give back to the forums once the job is done, but I do not think that would be the case. If I was paying you to write code for my platform, I "may" want it for myself( not shared ).

Maybe if there was a check to see a developer uploaded his code for a job after it's done might work. This is tough.

 

 

"Give back" is a tricky subject. I give a discounted rate to customers who are willing to open-source any re-usable aspects of the solution I develop for them. I find that approach is not understood by most corporations, though.

 

Based on the details @@bluehash has provided I think a small (~ 5$) fixed-price fee for any solicitation is a reasonable solution: making the solicitor have "skin in the game" should reduce the spam considerably. I'd hope the micropayment infrastructure would not be a huge impediment. A "free if the result is made public" policy is probably too complex to work.

 

I suspect that those who frequent this forum and who deal with this as a hobby will usually understand at least the basics of open source.  Certainly it should be made clear at the outset who owns the code or information gleaned, but I expect that open sourcing the results is probably not a big deal for hobbyist type requests for assistance.

(Assume you meant to say fee if results not made public?)

 

Consider that $5 may be a significant fraction of the value involved in the transaction, so a fixed fee tends to favor the wealthy.  Those with a lot of money/value at stake may regard it as insignificant, whereas it might discourage small jobs/nominal value "thank you" offers, etc.  

(Consider the example of Grameen bank, etc.)

If going for a set fee, then jobs below some set value should not have to pay, and either fixed or percentage for large amounts.

(i.e., the wealthy have an easier time making more money therefore they should contribute more in monetary terms).

Consider a donation basis, with possibly with suggested value - might make more cents - there are examples where in a community setting donation basis actually makes more than set fees.

 

@@bluehash Will this policy affect just 43oh?  If stellarisiti or the other fora will be involved also, then it would be good to post a pointer on those fora letting people there know about this discussion.

[bluehash 1,581]

@@igor Thank you for your input. I put it here in 43oh as it has a major base of the two and most are members of both. Also, it is better to have the discussion in one place. I'll cross link from there to here.

If there is a job section, it will encompass all communities.

[JonnyBoats 40]

Personally I believe there is a big difference between a regular contribuitor posting an oppurtunity where the primary motivation is to help others (my company is offering paid summer interships for students for example) and a head-hunter merely trying to earn a fee.

 

Perhaps a rule that states if you have been a member for at least a year, have so many reputation points, and will not be directly compensated for finding a canidate, then you can post for free would be good.

 

If someone comes along who does not meet these critera then let him buy an ad on the site(s).

[Rickta59 589]

I think the point most people are missing is this: the number of msp430 jobs out there is pretty limited. If we see 10 postings in a year I would be surprised.

 

If you look at dice.com, there have been only 4 postings in the last month that mention msp430. Of those only one was really an msp430 job. The rest were looking for general mcu experience and happened to mention the msp430

 

http://www.dice.com/job/results?caller=basic&q=msp430&x=all&p=

 

I say open it for all postings and let it get abused then reign it in if required.  If there are lots of jobs great, this site will benefit from more eyeballs and more click throughs, if not then oh well

 

-rick

[rockets4kids 204]

I'll point out that we're at 22 messages discussing two posts.

[DrWizard 5]

I'm one of the guilty parties here.  I posted a message offering a free display to someone who would collaborate with me to port a library/driver from another platform.  Igor is the one who took me up on the offer.  In our case, I don't believe a fee would be appropriate because:

1) We are sharing our work with the community.  The new library is open source and benefits everyone who may want to use that display.  It is not a commercial or "for-profit" venture.

2) I am just a retired hobbyist (although I used to be a professional programmer).  The overall value of the hardware I offered was only $30.

 

If it wasn't gonna be open to the community and/or there was a commercial interest and/or a lot more money involved, then some sort of fee would probably be appropriate.  Perhaps it might be best for now to take it on a case-by-case basis and privately and politely, ask for a donation when you feel it is justified.

 

[igor 163]

I'll point out that we're at 22 messages discussing two posts.

 

At least 4 posts.  There are the two posts that have been hidden, there are at least 2 other posts that would probably qualify as job offers.

 

I think concrete examples help discussion, so here are examples.

 

http://forum.stellarisiti.com/topic/1899-energia-tiva-usb-support/page-2#entry6534

 

http://forum.stellarisiti.com/topic/1949-free-16x32-led-matrix-help-me-adapt-arduino-library

 

I am not trying to single out these posts or the people involved,

these just happen to be ones I knew about, there are probably others.

(Since this discussion has not been announced on stellarisiti,

I PMd the posters a few days ago to make them aware of this discussion, figuring

they would have useful perspectives.)

 

To me both of these offer appear to fall in the hobbyist area, and I think such posts benefit the community.

(With the obvious disclaimer that I have benefited from one of these posts.)

Results shared back with community.  Restricting such offers means having to police

such things - where do you draw the line, possible bad feelings from those unfamiliar with

policy posting and then getting corrected, etc.

For that matter, bluehash has been quite liberal in offering various forms of sponsorship (thank you!) -

glass keyboard matrix thing in exchange for a review, etc.  

Would such offers also have to go in the jobs offered area?

(Not saying they should, or that such offers should not be made, just that it would be nice to

have a clear policy that applies consistently - easier to document, etc.)

[Fred 453]

Suggested donations seem like the easiest way to get some benefit from jobs on 43oh, especially if there aren't many anyway.

However, we should all consider what we get out of this site whether it's as obvious as some paid work or not. Have a think about how you personally have benefited. How does the help you've got here for free compare to (for instance) a copy of MSP430 Microcontroller Basics? And then there the contests, giveaways, etc.

There's a donate button. It may not get pushed at you, but maybe we should all think about giving it a click. Actually - I know there was a donate button.. but right now I can't find it. Where's it gone?   
 

[Rickta59 589]

We are the product here. The site needs us, not the other way around.

[zeke 693]

I am a developer for hire. I always have been. I like it a lot. The lifestyle is both challenging and rewarding. I have gotten comfortable with being uncomfortable as an entrepreneur.

 

It looks like we all would like to earn a living so, to push this topic forward, I will propose this: when you want to advertise yourself as a developer for hire on 43oh.com then give 43oh.com a fair donation for the privilege of advertising your services here.

 

The advertising could be in the form of:

1. An icon underneath your avatar or, 
2. Your name listed on a special developer's for hire page or,
3. The permission to put advertising in your signature.
4. All of the above.

I propose the donation to be 4.3% of the gross value (before deductions) of the contract. For example:

• You make USD $100 then donate $4.30.
• You make USD $430 then donate $18.49.
• You make USD $1000 then donate $43.00.

Or, the donation could be hard goods of equivalent value as the above donation scenario. You could do any of the following:

1. Design a product, blog about it completely on 43oh.com, give a free license to @@bluehash to reproduce it, put in his store and let him have 100% of the profits.
2. You build your awesome widget, donate a batch of your assembled products (say QTY 10) to 43oh.com, Let BH sell them in the store and let him have 100% of the profits.
3. Donate some of your unused LaunchPads or MSP430 IC samples or other awesome dev tools to 43oh.com and then BH can put on more giveaway contests.
4. Donate parts to the building of an unassembled product already in the 43oh.com store.
5. Donate assembly time to the building of an unassembled product already in the 43oh.com store.

If you want to mix and match the above levels of advertising then combine some of the above options to compose a fair compensation to @@bluehash.

 

 

This website is my digital home for all things MSP430. I want to continue contributing to its health and well being. While I cannot be here every hour of every day, there is someone who pretty much is. I choose to support him (them) so that this place continues to grow for the better. 

 

This website gives me a place to help and be helped in my personal projects and it also lets me demonstrate that I am a professional developer. 

 

 

I am willing to do what is fair for the privilege of attracting work from people who come here looking for a contractual developer. 

 

What do you guys (gals) think is fair for this privilege?

 

 

 

By the way, if this website had company shares then I would buy as many as I were allowed to buy.

 

 

[Rickta59 589]

I think the site should pay us for being contributing users.

 

The numbers are so large on here because of the fact that content is blocked unless you register and log in. This inflates the user count and also deters people from doing casual browing.  The actual active number of users is small compared to the total number of registered users.  This site really has about 200 active users.  The content on here was put here by those 200 people.

 

This site gets its ad revenue based on the number of users, not the number of active users.   When I first joined this site it was done in phpbb and didn't have any ads.  I don't like this new ipboards forum software. We went through a long period where posts got mangled or displayed strange characters or double posted or just acted strangely.

 

I don't think any of us should be paying for anything.

[zeke 693]

I think the site should pay us for being contributing users.

 

Yeah, I don't think that is going to fly. @@bluehash should just sell the board off to TI at that moment.

 

Besides, I do not imagine the ad revenue is significant at this moment in time. I bet B# is out of pocket on operating expenses and software licences most of the time.

 

 

I think you have to give away somethings for free (ie: how to make a blinking light or how to get this peripheral working) and I think that you have to monetize the more complex things (how to design, layout and program an WS2811 based, 1920x1080p wide screen display).

 

If I advertise my services here then I expect to pay something for that.

If I do not advertise my services here then I expect to pay nothing.

 

If someone reads this board, finds me then hires me solely based upon my reputation here then I do not expect to pay any advertising fee here.

If someone reads an ad I put on this board then hires me then I have already paid my dues based upon the fee I paid to advertise.

 

I believe the central issue in this thread is this: who pays when someone posts a non targeted Wanted classified ad and then I get hired.

 

Who has to pay for the advertising? Me, the poster of the Wanted ad or the owner of this website?

 

 

It's all about the advertising.